fun with .pso

The files located in images/envmaps are reflective 'highlight' maps. It was my assumption that these were directly linked to the shader material functions; the modeler names the surface the proper name to invoke the shader function and these maps will be used when the material is displayed to give added reflective highlights.

I was wondering how EoC used these maps, since they're located in a central location not able to be referenced by the models themselves. I forgot about using surface names to activate flux properties. Good thinking. Since reflection mapping can use not only a map in the reflection channel to control what parts are reflective and by how much (like luminosity), but also a map as a reflection map, I can see why it might need to be activated by a special surface name. Do you (or anybody) know what these surface name prefixes are?

However: I don't know what you mean by a reflective highlight map. Many of those maps in the resource file look like the industry standard reflection maps I've seen a hundred times before for games and animation. These maps are just ambiguous shapes that give the impression of reflected detail in a surface. You generally can't make them out well enough to see that they're not reflecting the actual environment. But you can see that they appear to be reflecting something. That makes the player think the surface is reflective. As the old 3D saying goes, "If it looks right, it is right." There is no such thing as a "real" reflection map. A "real" reflection doesn't need a map. The whole purpose of reflection maps are to simulate reflections. What you were refering to as "real" reflection maps are the pure "true" reflections I was talking about, meant to be used by slow 3D rendering programs (like Lightwave and 3dsMax). The ones that are created by tracing light from the reflective surface back to it's origin. And yes I agree, as I said earlier, you definitely wouldn't do this in a real-time application.

Given the relative uselessness of reflection maps, I doubt they would be implemented by just throwing a map in the LW surface reflection slot. But again... I've never made any tests in this area. Perhaps you should give it a try.

What do you mean by uselessness? Reflection maps are used everywhere. Especially in games. Anyplace you need super fast reflections (like low detail background objects in 3D animation, or reflections in real-time rendering applications). The map slot for reflection in a Lightwave surface is for determining what parts of a surface are reflective and by how much. Not for what the surface should be reflecting. That's what the reflection map slot under the Environment tab is used for. A reflection map overrides the raytrace and backdrop settings for a particular surface's reflection.

So, maybe the way it works is; a grayscale alpha mask in the reflection texture slot to identify what part of a surface is reflective and by how much (like luminosity), and a special surface name to tell flux which EoC reflection map to use there. Anyone ever see any surface names incorporating the names of the environment maps?

I would love to try adding some reflection maps to objects. But until I manage to get LW 5 I have to rely on you guys to test things out. My reflection maps work great for renderings done in LW, but in EoC they don't show up any better than my luminosity maps do.

*edit*
btw - I wasn't meaning to direct my notes on reflection at you personally Shane. It was actually more meant for everybody else. I was just using what you said as a good lead in to the subject.

mailto:second_chance@cox.net
The Ultimate Guide To Modding: I-War 2 - Edge Of Chaos
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I can see why it might need to be activated by a special surface name. Do you (or anybody) know what these surface name prefixes are?

I have no idea. However, these days I wouldn't be surprised if naming the surface 'Aluminium' or 'CastIron' or 'Chrome' wouldn't do the trick. Eventually I'll have to give that a try... or convert some station models and take a look at the surface naming conventions.

Originally posted by Shane

I can see why it might need to be activated by a special surface name. Do you (or anybody) know what these surface name prefixes are?

I have no idea. However, these days I wouldn't be surprised if naming the surface 'Aluminium' or 'CastIron' or 'Chrome' wouldn't do the trick. Eventually I'll have to give that a try... or convert some station models and take a look at the surface naming conventions.

Ahh, that rings a bell, there is a string thats present in some surface chunks in .pso that is either null, or one of:

Aluminium.iff
CastIron.iff
Chrome.iff
Copper.iff
Glass.iff
MattPaint.iff
Objects_IW2\_EnvironmentMaps\Aluminium.iff
Objects_IW2\_EnvironmentMaps\CastIron.iff
Objects_IW2\_EnvironmentMaps\Chrome.iff
Objects_IW2\_EnvironmentMaps\Glass.iff
Objects_IW2\_EnvironmentMaps\GlossPaint.iff
Objects_IW2\_EnvironmentMaps\SteelDull.iff
Objects_IW2\_EnvironmentMaps\SteelShiny.iff
SteelDull.iff
SteelShiny.iff

the images them selves are all circular blobs, and presumably effect the specular highlight (?) thats drawn on the model.

Flux is the only placce i've seen this kind of thing, i think of environment maps as things like this:



Digging around it's the RIMG chunk that converter.exe looks at to generate this bit of .pso files.

As for surface names, I assume the only thing that flux recognises in there is channels, and even then only if they are whithin '<', '>'.

On the other hand there is the #CSL(!PZ-)E1 type of stuff, Hmmmm.

I'll start another thread.


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If there is hope it lies with the demo scene.
PSO and FTEX tools: pointless.net/eoc/

Ahh, that rings a bell, there is a string thats present in some surface chunks in .pso that is either null, or one of:

Awsome! What's the whole string look like?

As for surface names, I assume the only thing that flux recognises in there is channels, and even then only if they are whithin '<', '>'.

Yes, animation channel information is contained within the < >. But, these are generally appended to the ends of normal surface names; like "fuselage_top <blah blah+(0.2)>". The numbers and symbols are usually input values for things like where to get the input from (joystick axis, etc) and animation speed. Does that help at all?

i think of environment maps as things like this:

The image that you have there is for a skybox. Which is not the same as the environment map function in a 3D package. I don't believe I've ever seen a skybox used for reflection mapping in a real-time app. They probably call these images "environment maps" in game design nowadays as a popular name, but the environment mapping refered to in serious 3D rendering is something else entirely. The use of the same name is coincidental.

Reflection maps like those you listed affect the specular, diffuse, and ambient lighting across a polygon's surface. But in a very subtle (probably additive) way.

On a related note: WOOHOO! I finally found LW 5 on Yahoo auctions. I paid a little more, but the guy let me buy it outright from him without bidding. Express mail should get it here in a few days! Kick ass!

mailto:second_chance@cox.net
The Ultimate Guide To Modding: I-War 2 - Edge Of Chaos
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Jasper, I've added some info and links to your EoC tool page and recent threads to my "Getting non-Lightwave created models into the game" tutorial (Addendum 2 if you want to look). I think being able to convert the original game models back into something that can be played with and built upon will inspire more people to want to create new ones. Thanks for all your hard work so far. Even I've been inspired to get some work done. And I'm pretty lazy.

mailto:second_chance@cox.net
The Ultimate Guide To Modding: I-War 2 - Edge Of Chaos
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New version up in the usual place:

uvmaps for specular and glow should be in place, let me know if lw can still read the files.

added pso-info.exe which (depending on the command line args) prints different info about .pso files.

added command line args to pso2lwo and pso2lwo2 - you can specify the output filename etc.



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If there is hope it lies with the demo scene.
PSO and FTEX tools: pointless.net/eoc/