My feelings on the Star Wars mod.

Originally posted by Second Chance

I don't think that's correct. If that were the case, then the length, height and width entries in the INI would be irrelevant. But since these entries supposedly affect the collision detection and collision warning systems then they must use a bounding box instead of a bounding sphere.

I just went out and made some tests (and a lot of screenies) using dev mode and [Game.DevToggleBounds]. The "Bounds" mode shows you red and blue circles around each object that represent the collision detection radius and the avoidence radius. (If you've never used that mode try it out, you'll see lots of interesting stuff)

Using the same ini file for a station I changed the dimensions entry from 60x237x300 to 1300x1300x1300 and then to 100x100x1000.

The dimensions have no influence on the shape, or size of the hud target marker (the parenthesis around the object). The dimensions don't change the size of the collision detection radius or the avoidance radius as far as I can tell (seen using the dev mod graphical representation thereof). The Hud target marker parenthesis are always on the outside edge of the blue circle you see in "Bounds" mode.
The screen shots I made were at the same distances (4, 10 and 60km) and with the same nearby objects in the background for use as a reference. I could see no difference whatsoever regardless of the ini entry.

The entry in the ini, is however as you say not, irrelevant: it does effect the collision detection in reference to shots fired at the object.

I definitely do think, though, that Shane should build one huge detailed Death Star and then just simply chop it up into something like 20-40 seperate models (each with it's own appropriate CH). Then have all those pieces simply docked to an invisible central structure that would serve as the hud target (a la MajorTom's idea).

That might do it whereas, with "invisible central structure" I'm assuming you mean not visible from the outside when the other pieces are attached. (the central structure would have to have a CH and a round avatar to show in the Hud Target window).

The point I am trying to make is: if all the pieces (avatars and hulls), were round (sphere shaped) you wouldn't need to have a central structure because any one of them could be the parent that everything else is docked to. (and the HUD would always show that one round parent).

i.e To create the "round" pieces you can make the DS, chop it's surface into convex squares then give each square a round CH and a round avatar. Then put the dockports via the setup scene inside the CH surface in a form that matches the square you chopped out.

The visible part of the avatar (DS surface structure) would then be a square surface in the middle of the (circle) piece. They would blend together when the round hull pieces are docked together and the hulls overlap to form a square. Because, the dockports were placed in the form of a square inside the surface of the collision hull (at a slight angle to make them dock in a convex form.)

The other point I noted is: if you use a round avatar on a round collision hull, the visible squares (DS surface structure) of the avatar will be below the avatar surface (like under the roof of the hydroponic gardens you see on Haven Station)

But, if I understood SecondChance correctly that isn't a problem??

If you use a central structure all the pieces of the DS will have to be an elongated 3D square shape and very pointed on the one end where they dock to the central structure, otherwise the central structure would have to be very large itself.






Iwar2 Multiplayer Fan Site

Originally posted by EricMan64

If multiplayer cannot handle the death star, I would still create it for use in single player. It would be worth it, even only as an experiment into large objects in the flux engine. (we've learned a lot so far haven't we?) Iconic objects often work well enough for multiplayer, so you could create a non-sectioned DS shrunk to just small enough to work. Then the full size could be used in single player in all its detailed glory.

I agree

If you use a central structure all the pieces of the DS will have to be an elongated 3D square shape and very pointed on the one end where they dock to the central structure, otherwise the central structure would have to be very large itself.

Thats not quite right: you could make them t-shaped and put the dockport way outside the CH like a baloon on a string. but the slightest twist over the length will cause them to misalign


If you use the "Round square object" method you'll need 4 dockports on each "round" square but they will all have axactly the same position and the same angle so it should be easier? and it will be cake to dock them together with pog

Iwar2 Multiplayer Fan Site

Okay... let me get this straight.

We create an object with an invisible avatar (which is quite easy) and a spherical collision hull (largest size which still works). That gives us our center object. This object will show up on the HUD wireframe display.

Then, we create the 'panels' of the Death Star. Probably make them icCargoPod and place a dockport at the relevant position on each one. Each panel will have it's own collision hull (just like a cargo pod), and will dock to the center object. The collision hull for each panel will be a single plane... not an enclosed space.

Then, a POG script will be made which will cull out the sections which are not in the player's POV.

Have I got this right?



<font size="1"><font face="Book Antiqua"><font color="black">"Never before in the history of the world had such a mass of human beings moved and suffered together. This was no disciplined march; it was a stampede-- without order and without a goal, six million people unarmed and unprovisioned, driving headlong. It was the beginning of the rout of Civilisation... of the massacre of Mankind."
--H. G. Wells The War Of The Worlds</font id="black"></font id="Book Antiqua"> </font id="size1">

Good job, MajorTom. At least now we know what's up with the collision detection. And you're right about one thing for sure; why bother making pointy DS sections when you could just make a round cap at the top and bottom. But I personally think there should still be a central structure to tie it all together.

Shane - You got it, baby!

If you use the "Round square object" method you'll need 4 dockports on each "round" square but they will all have axactly the same position and the same angle so it should be easier? and it will be cake to dock them together with pog

This is a good idea also.

mailto:second_chance@cox.net
The Ultimate Guide To Modding: I-War 2 - Edge Of Chaos (on hold during SW MP mod)
cartoons.sev.com.au/index.php?catid=4
.

Originally posted by Shane


Then, a POG script will be made which will cull out the sections which are not in the player's POV.

I'm looking into the code for your approach now. We may have to cull dependent on the players FOV in relation to the lights FOV. Otherwise the player might see nothing (or a hole) where the DS should actually be reflecting light.

How many sections do you suppose, roughly, will the complete DS have?
And for me to get an idea about the size of each piece, how many of those pieces would be needed to make up the dish surface area?

You can use a central object if you wish, but it doesn't need to be any particular size. We can easly manipulate the relationship of the CH to the avatar mesh on the central object so the thing shows the right size proportions in the Hud.
Also you don't need dockports because pog has:
Sim.AddChildRelativeTo( hsim parent, hsim child, float x, float y, float z );

I'm sorry I apparently can't come across with my vision of the big hollow structure.
That would enable us to dynamically build a given surface area of the DS dependent on the players FOV as he gets closer or moves around. So, you would never actually have to have the whole DS in the game.

Another try:
Haven't you seen the TV comercial that offers 3D puzzles for the earth. Each piece of the puzzle is a slightly convex flat piece of plastic (maybe a hundered pieces) and when you put them together you have a round hollow globe.

Comparably, each piece of the DS 'puzzle' could be an identical flat convex square with a dockport (reference plane) on each of the 4 sides.
Putting a globe formed CH / Avatar mesh on each piece has no relevance as far a making the actual model pieces goes or it's surface textures.
That is just to fake the HUD mesh display so any one of the surface pieces could be the (targettable!) parent object that every thing else is docked to.


Iwar2 Multiplayer Fan Site

Ahhh... Thanks. Got it, MajorTom.

I'll try to put together an estimate tonight of the DS sections (including the trenches).



<font size="1"><font face="Book Antiqua"><font color="black">"Never before in the history of the world had such a mass of human beings moved and suffered together. This was no disciplined march; it was a stampede-- without order and without a goal, six million people unarmed and unprovisioned, driving headlong. It was the beginning of the rout of Civilisation... of the massacre of Mankind."
--H. G. Wells The War Of The Worlds</font id="black"></font id="Book Antiqua"> </font id="size1">